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Nord ignition problems
Hi all,
Lately I've been having some strange problems with ignition. When I try to start my engine in the morning it fires up and then dies with a cough. Okay, that's normal but then it happens: On the next attempt the engine is completely dead! Sofar I've replaced the distributor cap, the lead wire between the coil and distributor and the spark plugs. At some point I even replaced the coil with one I've had lying around for some years. Since there was no change and I lacked equipment to cut the tie wraps I put the old one back. Somehow later during the day it just seems to come back to life and I can eventually start it. Once running there's no trace of anything being wrong. I can cut it and restart it without any sign of problems, even after several hours. The next morning it's back to square one... I've taken the whole thing apart this weekend. Cleaned up everything but still haven't found the source. The strangest thing happened when I removed the spark plug from cylinder 1 to see if I had a spark at all: with the plug removed the engine seemed to come to life, with the spark plug put back in it was completely dead again. I verified this behaviour, three times in a row. That's the point where I replaced the spark plugs and thought I'd finaly found it, until this morning... :( Anyone have any clues? Please, I'm at the end of it.... Gordon Gordon Giulietta 1.8 '82 GT Junior 2.0 '75 GT Junior 2.0 '74 (project) |
Gordon wrote:
> Hi all, > > Lately I've been having some strange problems with ignition. When I > try to start my engine in the morning it fires up and then dies with a > cough. Okay, that's normal but then it happens: > When you say 'completely dead' you mean turning over, but not firing? Have you checked the lopw voltage side of the coil? We had the same problem with our Giulietta when I rebuilt it the first time. Eventually I traced the fault to the ignition switch. It was energising the solenoid so the engine turned, but not energising the coil, so no spark HTH -- Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3 Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply) Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk |
Correct: it turns, but no indication of spark at all.
The frustating part is that it seems to run flawless at some point but then the next morning..... On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 17:31:49 GMT, Catman > wrote: >Gordon wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Lately I've been having some strange problems with ignition. When I >> try to start my engine in the morning it fires up and then dies with a >> cough. Okay, that's normal but then it happens: >> > >When you say 'completely dead' you mean turning over, but not firing? Have >you checked the lopw voltage side of the coil? > >We had the same problem with our Giulietta when I rebuilt it the first >time. Eventually I traced the fault to the ignition switch. It was >energising the solenoid so the engine turned, but not energising the coil, >so no spark > >HTH Gordon Giulietta 1.8 '82 GT Junior 2.0 '75 GT Junior 2.0 '74 (project) |
On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 09:33:46 +0200, Gordon
> wrote: >Correct: it turns, but no indication of spark at all. > >The frustating part is that it seems to run flawless at some point but >then the next morning..... > Definitely check that the coil is being energised. ours used to do something simlar. You;d be driving along, and it would just die. You could re-start it immediately, but you had no idea how long it would be...... -- Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply) Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l. Really, Sprint 1.7 Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk |
Well, that's not quite it. Once it runs, it runs. It doesn't die while
driving. I'll check both your suggestion and the one made by MeatballTurbo though. Thanks... On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 09:01:38 GMT, Catman > wrote: >On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 09:33:46 +0200, Gordon > wrote: > >>Correct: it turns, but no indication of spark at all. >> >>The frustating part is that it seems to run flawless at some point but >>then the next morning..... >> > >Definitely check that the coil is being energised. ours used to do >something simlar. You;d be driving along, and it would just die. You >could re-start it immediately, but you had no idea how long it would >be...... Gordon Giulietta 1.8 '82 GT Junior 2.0 '75 GT Junior 2.0 '74 (project) |
On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 12:07:41 +0100, MeatballTurbo
> wrote: >In article >, says... >> On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 09:33:46 +0200, Gordon >> > wrote: >> >> >Correct: it turns, but no indication of spark at all. >> > >> >The frustating part is that it seems to run flawless at some point but >> >then the next morning..... >> > >> >> Definitely check that the coil is being energised. ours used to do >> something simlar. You;d be driving along, and it would just die. You >> could re-start it immediately, but you had no idea how long it would >> be...... >> >> >Does this sound like a grounding issue? > >I thought that when I first read it, but not been mentioned yet. Could be I guess. Ground strap to the engine may well have that kind of effect. -- Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply) Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l. Really, Sprint 1.7 Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk |
On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 14:00:41 +0200, Gordon
> wrote: >Well, that's not quite it. Once it runs, it runs. It doesn't die while >driving. I suspect that might be a fluke. >I'll check both your suggestion and the one made by >MeatballTurbo though. Aye. Check the grounding strap, and the battery ground as well come to that >Thanks... Hope you sort it -- Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply) Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l. Really, Sprint 1.7 Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk |
In article >,
says... > On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 12:07:41 +0100, MeatballTurbo > > wrote: > > >In article >, > says... > >> On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 09:33:46 +0200, Gordon > >> > wrote: > >> > >> >Correct: it turns, but no indication of spark at all. > >> > > >> >The frustating part is that it seems to run flawless at some point but > >> >then the next morning..... > >> > > >> > >> Definitely check that the coil is being energised. ours used to do > >> something simlar. You;d be driving along, and it would just die. You > >> could re-start it immediately, but you had no idea how long it would > >> be...... > >> > >> > >Does this sound like a grounding issue? > > > >I thought that when I first read it, but not been mentioned yet. > > Could be I guess. Ground strap to the engine may well have that kind > of effect. > > I know I don't yet own an Alfa, and that while never as bad as portrayed Alfa electricals are stuff of legend, but I've only ever owned older cars, and I'm amazed at how some of them have kept running with the main ground strap from the engine to the chassis being about 3 strands of left of the original inch wide strap. And the Saab has it's own problems with heat from the turbo reducing wiring insulation close by to the consistency of candle wax after 20 years of being slowly grilled everyday. Normally any malfunction in wiring (after related components have tested or replaced) usually relates to either a broken wire, or a ground issue. If it was a physically broken wire then the fault would most likely be less than intermittent. A bad loose or dirty ground can have just that effect, as they tend to go at or near where they connect to a common point, and in many case main ground point/straps/cables aren't as insulated as the live positives, so if they touch they work, but then come away and stop. -- The poster formerly known as Skodapilot. http://www.bouncing-czechs.com |
MeatballTurbo wrote:
> In article >, > says... >> On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 12:07:41 +0100, MeatballTurbo >> > wrote: >> >> >In article >, >> says... >> >> On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 09:33:46 +0200, Gordon >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >Correct: it turns, but no indication of spark at all. >> >> > >> >> >The frustating part is that it seems to run flawless at some point >> >> >but then the next morning..... >> >> > >> >> >> >> Definitely check that the coil is being energised. ours used to do >> >> something simlar. You;d be driving along, and it would just die. You >> >> could re-start it immediately, but you had no idea how long it would >> >> be...... >> >> >> >> >> >Does this sound like a grounding issue? >> > >> >I thought that when I first read it, but not been mentioned yet. >> >> Could be I guess. Ground strap to the engine may well have that kind >> of effect. >> >> > I know I don't yet own an Alfa, and that while never as bad as portrayed > Alfa electricals are stuff of legend, but I've only ever owned older > cars, and I'm amazed at how some of them have kept running with the main > ground strap from the engine to the chassis being about 3 strands of > left of the original inch wide strap. They only carry large current when actually cranking though, don't they? > And the Saab has it's own problems with heat from the turbo reducing > wiring insulation close by to the consistency of candle wax after 20 > years of being slowly grilled everyday. heh. Quite fancy one of them one day -- Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3 Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply) Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk |
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